Not as uneven but it still sucks to play vs 1 man army. gl in finals.

gg diki!

No sajko on dm2 cost csn the game. This guy probably has the most bjud out of anyone in the world, bad choice of csn.

Noone, a word which I have to repeat, _noone_ has the knowledge and fortitude that this guy has. He's straight up beasting.

Fu should consider themself lucky.

what mawe just said x2

Hehe, yep QW is really that easy... we can try 1on4 if you like :D
Also Milton won all matches by himshelf for tVS so thanks Milton!!! But we really should ban you to make games more intresting.

In dm2 RKD was the star in the field and you should have won that map. But seems like you have some work to do with teamplay.

Actually I have never seen FU playing so solid teamplay as we did now so it was really easy to play.

Also tight and good games. So GG.

Hooraytio: you had to chance to put FU in div1, so quit whining ;)

We had the chance to make 5-6 teams go idle, we decided not to. No whine.

nice effi Diki ;)

In my opinion csn has a very solid team and skilled players so they could be in div1 just as well as we could. The game last night was tight and could have gone either way. Even with our oh-so-mighty div1 superstars diki and kassim.

Even if 5-6 teams went idle, there would still be more teams in div2, than in div1... so wouldnt matter that much.

I'm so disappointed guys :( Especially in you rikodinosaur, I thought you promised to outfrag Diki?????

There are a few problems with the current system and the scene in general.

Players in general dont feel like taking on a greater challenge. Some do, but they are few. There is no reward for getting beat up badly in 4-5 games even though you have 5-6 even games. These clans rather play in div2 to get 5-6 even games and the rest are easy. Same goes for top div3 clans, why take on div2 when you can surf thru div3?

The list of mid-low div1 players seeking to play in div2 is becoming endless, leaving almost only the top players left in div1. Same with some mid-low div2 players seeking too play in div3.

I have also talked to players who said stuff like: this is prolly our last season, we dont feel like having a hard time in divX. Or: Player A is good but he is not very active and has bad ping so you cant judge our lineup with him in it.


And niw, when we only have 30 teams its pretty damn bad if 6 of them idles. We have enough scared, idle div1 playes as it is because they "cant win div1 anyway" and "are not allowed to play with their friends in div2, bullshit admins!"

Perhaps make 2 larger, equally strong divisions and have them meet in A, B and C playoffs depending on their final place in respective division? You will play hard, equal and easy teams but the playoffs should be fun and competetive for everyone.

Yeah sure, but people wanna play anyway and if they are placed in div1 and stop playing because of that, they wont be able to paticipate in eql at all, so they will fuck things up for themselves, more than they will fuck things up for us, already playing in eql.

And the clans in div1 wont notice that div2 will have less clans anyway, so it wont make much of a difference and there would only be teams for two divisions, instead of 3, that could also be arranged, because lets face it, quake is a 15 year old game and compared to many other games, its still being played alot, even though the scene is way smaller than a couple of years ago.

If EQL would have had kenya maps in it, I wouldnt have played and thats my own fault, but thats because I don't like the maps.

And the fact that there are alot of free div1 agents, that refuse to play with eachother, is just pathetic, because they already know they dont stand a chance vs. the good clans.

I don't consider myself to be in div1, when looking at some of the players that are in div2, but it had to come some day .. and even though C88 wont win eql, we will still try to put up a good struggle and it's still more fun and challenging that raping in div2.

One game played and so much drama. Maybe you should watch and see more games played until making these conclusions.

Frag difference was like 80 in two maps and now FU or Diki (your words) is too good to be in div2. Seems like someone is trying to get a easy win in div2 :P

Btw. in div1 (eql12) we (tVS) won games with (+3848/11maps=) 350 plus frags in each game so this 80 is a really equal score.

Sure some teams could have played in div1 but they dont want to and would have idled or try to join some other div2 team or have too wide skill gaps (just another reason to bitch and moan if we had placed them in div1), but some teams are just totally out of the question for div2. And thats why we dont even see certain players this season...

<3 mawe

Yeah Diki, csn is trying to get an easy win in div2. If that was the case I would just have put all hard teams in div1. We ended 2nd two seasons ago and 7th last season even when we had ok98. We won div4 once but I wasnt even admin that season so you can stop your conspiracy theories.

It isnt drama, it is a discussion about the problem with fewer and fewer players wanting to play in div1.

BLT for president! Ohoy all, we still need 2 ACTIVE div1'ish players for our lineup to smash the div1 najbs! If you feel like up for the task, let us know @ irc #blt !

So who again was raped yesterday? I must have been watching a different game than some of you. This time div1 = div0 and div2 is div 1.5 + some others. Who cares about divisions, we are getting to see some tight games (like yesterday) and that is the only thing that matters.

We knew which clans we added to the divisions and the players they had. Everyone gets a little mad after a loss and ofc it feels extra lame when the other team had an ex-tvs players. Wouldnt you agree?

However, now clans consisting of 100% div1 players have even asked to join div2 after the league allready started. Teams who are already good have also tried to add div1 players. Anyway, they can forget about getting to play under such circumstances making such demands.

Well, we didn't wanna surf thru div3 anymore, we just took fix along and went for the div2 superstars! Last 2 seasons went just without single prac, but now we're motivated and might even play one during the season! Next season - DIV1.

So the wrong team won.

Go fix kill them all! Whine lamers don't deserve any better!

:o games were kinda tight and I felt like we had a chance to take dm3 but screwed it up with like 3-4 mins left when we let diki take rl to ra.
Always gotta be a team who wins and if you will end up as the winner of div2 then losing by this amount is by no means bad.

But losing is always gonna piss me off and most other people aswell, and when you see diki with 70% effi each map and overall stats that none of his mates come near then it's easy to whine about it.
Ofcourse it's way too early to tell but it should also be remembered that fu finished 3rd last season after blt and koff, who aren't playing in div2 this season, which practically made you the top candidate to win div2, without diki.
And there lies my problem with the situation but it has nothing to do with fu, it's with admins allowing a top team to get such a player, making it even harder for the bottom teams.

And about this whole div1 players who sneak into div2, well you could make a list of players you consider too good for div2 and say that if they wanna play eql they gotta play in div1 :).
Who knows it could work, and they are usually quite spread out so don't think alot of div2 clans would disband because of it.

#22 ofc the wrong team won. who doesnt want to win? :)

#25 That list would ofc vary from season to season depending on the number of clans etc. Also, its very hard to draw an exact line.

But everyone will have a greater chance at playing in their preferred surroundings if they are upfront about it before we make the divisions.

The underlying problem is still that there arent any other incentives for playing in div1 except that it is challenging, and that does not cut it for the majority of the players.

QW lives as long as people get so angry after losing.

So, are there any div2 teams I can join?

#29 maybe in div3, all current div2 clans are clearly div1 material!

Btw. Diki is way beyond div2, hell it's not even common to see 10 teamkills in div1 rounds! Wonder why he gets so many frags? He rapes all the competition, including teammates!

Chosen, Wake up, this is BULLSHIT!

FU is a perfect example of a clan that most players romanticize about. They have been around for ages (earliest memories I have with them are from Villains I!), still own a website, participate basically every season and every league (no matter the rules), get their damn games played, prac occassionally and represent consistency that many teams lack.

Everyone knows FU never has been and are not among the very top teams. Placing them in div 1 onto the playground as punching balls ("filler material") for the stronger teams is kind of a punishment for being what on the other hand is glorified. FU is an excellent div2 team and if they win this season easily, they deserve it.

So why again did they have to bring a div0 player into that glorified happy div2 clan that has managed such a long time without?

"wow 33 comments" - I thought to myself. Was our game really that interesting? Then I noticed it was just another div-whine thread.

Everyone knew this was going to happen before the season begun, no reason to go all huge fuzz about it now. There are other similar clans/players in div2 as well, and they know who they are.

I will have to agree that it's really frustrating losing a game much based on a single player. However it's a teamgame and in the end the games were fun and close!

I would like to say good game to the entire FU clan. And Im sure you will show that youre capable of playing good even without Diki in the field later on this season.

well put andy

Last season Diki didn't play with -fu- because that would have made them (then) a div1 clan.

Chosen had a similar situation last year when a player wanted to join and play in div2. But him joining would have lifted the clan to div1, so it didn't happen.

Unless you have very motivated players who want to improve (rare), it's important to recruit so that you avoid ending up at the bottom of a div. It's not lame, it's good management. Losing too much can kill clans.

@33: I don't think it's right to call this situation "bring a div0 player into that glorified happy div2 clan" when the questioned player had been with this team for ages. It's not as if FU "bought" a star player in order to win div2.

By the way, on a slightly different matter. On the one hand some people speak about teams not wanting to improve and their laziness, not taking risks and effort etc.

On the other hand, what's the point in improving when it actually means you're put into a division where you don't win a game instead of playing in a league in which you expect to win many games because you improved due to a lot of pracs or a new good player. Improvement means punishment.

In this very case, you are talking about Diki (re)joining -FU-, the team he had already played for in Smackdown - more than 10 years ago. Once you start telling people not to play with their friends anymore because you are becoming too good, all kind of motivation gets eliminated.

Andy you are the man! You really put your words right... :)

As he mentioned I started my qwdm career in cg and then joined fu even cmf was offering me a contract. I thought it was more challenging... but now im too old for that :P

Atm Im just happy to play some qw again and helping fu with tactics. Maybe I (or we) will play in div1 next year when I get a new connection and some aiming skills :) who knows

quote: Btw. in div1 (eql12) we (tVS) won games with (+3848/11maps=) 350 plus frags in each game so this 80 is a really equal score.
---
Actually it says 21maps/4613= 219 frags per map. So 350 is grossly exaggerated. Apart from that that is the top of the top lineup that can even make div1 teams look like div2, and they had some REALLY easy games. And to compare FU in div1 to old tVS in div1 is just a joke. Try compare overall to top 3 teams perhaps :)

Although I do agree that we should wait some games to see how div2 will develop before making any comments on that - however i still think we should have more teams in div1, regardless if you think you will ALSO get even games in div2 against some of the teams there.

quote: On the other hand, what's the point in improving when it actually means you're put into a division where you don't win a game instead of playing in a league in which you expect to win many games because you improved due to a lot of pracs or a new good player. Improvement means punishment.
-----
lol? Yeah it' spunishment because div1 has now beem diminished to only the TOP TOP teams on the scene instead of the top 1/3 or something similar.. As soon as blt stepped up they were looking for div1 players to beef up their overall team.

So what now if there were 8 teams like blt in div1, now suddenly sr/fom/sd/tks doesn't seem that important anymore. Sure they are likely to stay in top 4, Just as I'm sure the top 4 in div2 are pretty much set.

It's not like bottom half of div2 has a snowballs chance in hell of making it in the top there either, they are just content because of the larger division so they got more opponents equal, under and above.

Now being moved up to div1 is punishment because there are only much better teams.

I think one of the teams that are trying to close the gap is c88. We also know they won't have a big chance but it's still solid lineup.

There are many div1 players outthere to make at least 3 other solid div1 teams that could easily compete with c88 - and maybe that kind of action would attract old/new really good players to join those ranks and try to close the gap even more.

Yeah its just sad that all of them either join div2 or idle.

Or...
They just prefer joining old friends instead of forming a team that probably will disband after one season.
Too bad that there's only a handful of CLANS in the QW community. Teams are not what some ppl are looking for.

What will happen if you gather 5 inactive players to one clan? How many games they will play? :)

Atleast I dont want to play games every week so its better not to start anything you wont finish. Like FT last season. But yeah I know Im not in that group you meant.... "old/new really good players".

I have a solution!
Let's start a boycot against two or three top clans and just wait they going to retire. After that they will join random clans and the gap is gone and we have equal games again!!!

#43 agreed about the clans. But atleast we have seen some clans make a comeback this season which is great! :)

#44 how come all these idlers join div2 then? :)

I agree with para, there's only a handful of team that even has a remote chance of winning anything in div2, div3 just as in div1. But its like the old saying "Better to rule in hell than to serve in heaven". Why move into a small division where every team is atleast a div better than your own team? The ONLY solution is to make a huge div1 with atleast 16 teams where everyone can atleast have some fun.

NO! The boycott is the only and right way to solve this problem. I dont get what these top clans gets from rape games... Atleast for me it was so boring to play vs SR.

#48
+1

Ofc now the problem is that everyone wants to the finals and chance to win, even if that's an illusion for most of the clans hence the division.
Imo divisions are the cancer of community of this size, and stopped most of the players evolving.

For example I'll say that if blt keeps praccing div1 clans this season and plays all games "seriously", they will mop the floors with every div2 clan after the season with such an ease, and next season they will start taking maps from div1 clans aswell. Dunno if that is what they want, but I sure hope so :)

Anyway, if the direction of div1 is gonna continue this way, it sure will look bad in no more than 1-2 seasons. Well..it looks bad allready.