I'm pretty sure not single teams wanna step up to the slaughter alone, if they don't know others will follow them from div2

That's why I suggested either pretty big division 1, with lots of interesting games for middle/bottom teams, or worse alternative very small with only teams that has actual chance of winning.

If I was any div2 team right now I certainly wouldn't wanna go up to div1 alone. "5 rape games, probably times 2, or pwn 10 games in div2 and get perhaps 5 tough but even games.... tough choice!"

Yeah, I edited an extra part at the end so you dont have to come forward in public and perhaps regret it. The one team we have now are interested even if they going alone.

Anyways, you know where we are.

Is it us Hooraytio? I'm keen to kick som Slackers asses Be

my own team, the newly formed crazy 88, we probably arent anywhere near winning the division, but even taking a map from a top team, or playing a close game in division 1 is the most rewarding and fun experience in all of quakeworld,

and i'm sure with lots of practice and the right attitude lots of players who are now in div2 can make that come true, look at teamkillers for example, sure they got some significant reinforcement now from ganon and moltas,

but ddk and en_karl are relative rookies in the game compared to all/most of the players now in div2, and yet they can easily challenge and even beat div1 teams now, there is absolutely nothing stopping the rest of you from doing the same, practice makes perfect.

if any team at all from div2 steps up, you sirs have balls of steel, and my respect!

div1 is what quakeworld 4on4 is all about.

If any div2 team wants to step up to div1 and want me to come along on the journey, then I'm all yours 8)

We could release Hagge as a loan with option to buy (around 500£ + 25£ each time he topfrags from date of acquisition) if some team is interested in going to div1!

Chosen might have been interested if ok98 had stayed and I was sure that Hagge and Pyta would play many games. Just as in eql12 where we had TheEvilDog as a potential div1 guide, alltho it didnt happen.

Now with me probably playing around 80-90% and rio, rkd, anupko, sajko and xero as most active lineup i can see atleast 5 div2 teams better suited for div1 than csn.

Anyway, we stopped forcing teams into div1 as it leads to too much whine and low quality games.

Guess I'm not gonna topfrag many times then since my teammates would probably TK me even if I have 200/200 rl+lg+quad to save themselves some money :E

Don't worry Hooraytio, I will be active as well! You will see tonight when we prac! There's a 100% chance I will be there :E

Ok nice!

To be fair Hagge, if you have Quad the problem is likely to take care of itself ;)

cara :(((

We're up for the challenge I can admit it in public!, and para: We would've requested to join in div1 even if we were the only one from div2.. Now that it has come to all of our attention that we're infact not the onlyone im only glad :) A few more would be more than welcome tho' imo.

Why did you request div3 in the first place kapo? :) And has DC now abandoned div1 request?

We (FU) should also apply to div1 if we wanted to invest a lot in QW. But we don't. Div2 is okay for casual quakers...

Don't ask me, torch did the signing up part from our behalf :D Maybe he wanted to imitate fOm, they requested for div3 also when they signed up ;D

he signed us up without the rest of us even knowing about it :)

The requests arent that important, atleast not when topdivX clans request a lower division.

What is interesting for us, however, is when a clan request a higher division than we would expect.

Why dont you div1 guys do some coaching? Hlt, ihminen, and other well experienced div1 players could train some div2 materials into div1.

I guess they dont have the interrest or time to do any.. Think they've done it already if they had.

#16
So you think 2 players who are not even playing EQL this season will be willing to provide some coaching? :E

they were only examples, but if you read it again, you will realise :P

Pretty obvious from the start that div3 request from BLT wasn't serious.

Hmm I was pretty sure it was fu that had applied for div1..

Well cool of you guys in BLT, I admire your decision.

Thx, nah not fu... I'd bet for dc since they requested for div1 all the way from the beginning of singups

Oh wait, I read the post really wrong, there is no other div2 team requested to join in div1 :D hihih my bad ;D

Not yet, but maybe your courage will encourage DC to do the same kapo? :E

Doubt it ;)

Why not just reduce size of div2, and have div1 and div2 play against eachother.
This will make the div2 teams eager to actually play those div1 games because they need at the very least the activity points to get a better ranking in their own division for div2 playoffs.
And it should keep teams from quitting cause they are misplaced (they are still in div2 and got their own playoffs).
This idea of doing one large div1 with putting teams that have a chance to play 3-4 tight games and get raped another 5-6 times is just idiotic and leads to the teams not playing at all, like what happened in eql 12.

I've been suggesting this continuosly since before the start of eql12, can't be only me who actually sees this as a great solution to alot of problems.
Div2 clans will gain some experience against top teams and should be motivated to try and get better each season to try and steal a map from the weakest div1 teams.
The fact that they are still in their own division however makes those rapes actually count for something (activity points).
And I really don't see how any team in div2 would quit because they have to play a few games against div1 clans when the games actually mean something, and they wont have to face them in playoffs.
Should help to increase the level of current div2 teams aswell as to keep the div1/2 teams rather satisfied.

Now ofcourse this is if you actually want div2 teams and div1 teams to play eachother.
If you do I don't see a better solution, atleast it's certainly better than "put 5 div2 clans to div1 and watch 4 of them quit".
:)

Ive also seen ppl wanting a smackdown style league. Well afaik during the very last season of smackdown the division plague was already upon us and some teams just couldnt be bothered to play vs the best teams in their group. Sadly enough I think this will happen again.

"Lol slackers/f0m/sd/etc is in our group, well fuck this."

Some possibly very controversial idea: Allow multi-clanning. With divisions strictly separated (unless the cross-playoff idea I gave in the other thread is considereed) there are no conflicts of interest between the divs, so that highly skilled players from div2 could play both with their friends in div2 and additionally form a random superteam with others and compete in div1.

This might close some gaps of teams, fill the lines of missing players, get some off the free players pool actually form new teams and enable some players to taste div1 air. What about a Div2 allstar team with Fix, JJ, Medar, Hagge, Diki, ok98 (for example, if there's interest) joining div1?

Great idea, except it kinda negates the whole concept of a clan/guild/team if you just play in different teams. Don't know if I like that trend.

Also I don't even understand rkd's proposal.... let div1 teams play against div2 teams, this will not be the same as basically merging div2 and div1?
What do you mean let div2 and div1 play against each other.

And the smackdown thing - well ofc the div1 temas are favourite in all the groups, but the other 4 teams are still fighting over who will go to what playoff group and who will not go anywhere... so what inf there is a favourite in group stages.

@ #16
Correct me if I'm wrong but didn't SR try this for some time with a few players which they took from lower divs (with some degree of success I might add) but they were met with a lot of flak from the community because they were being accused of just doing it for their own benefit (internal pracs and poaching players from active div2-3 clans).

I understand RKD's proposal and think it's quite genius. Basically what he's trying to say is that even though you are in separate divs the clans in div2 who do decide to play against all the div1 clans have a better shot at reaching playoffs than the clans who don't because they don't want to get raped. So basically you are forcing div2 clans to play against div1 clans to stay in the race for winning div2 and also give the div1 clans more games than just the other 5 clans in their own div.
Does that make sense?

This would of course mean that even if you lose a game, you would have to get points (1 for lose, 2 for tie, 3 for win?)

So long story short, you do basically merge div1 and div2 when it comes to playing your games, but the clans in their respective divs still have a chance to win their own div and not have a guaranteed spot which is never going to be higher than 6th or 7th.

What springs said.
Div1 has for example 8 clans, div2 has 8 clans.
Team slackers in div1, play the 7 teams in div1 once, and the 8 teams in div2 once.
So it's similar to a merge just that the teams have their own division, their own standings, and their own playoff.
You don't actually compete against the teams in the other division, it's just a means to get more points to increase your position in your own division.

As a div1 or div2 team it doesn't matter at all how many points, +/- stats the teams in the opposite division have.

I can already imagine the whine from clan Y being on top of clan X in div1 standings due to being able to get more div2 clans playing vs them. Because lets face it, activity points or not, not all matches are going to get played.

I would like to add that except what I just said and a few minor stuff. I like the idea, or at least the creativity of trying to solve the problem in a better way.

sounds retarded to me.. why not play in same division then... if you are #1 in division 2 or #9 in a merged division is exactly the same outcome, u have to play the same matches

no it's not, if you are number 1 in division 2 you have to play number 8 in division 2 in your first playoff game. For example DC vs CSN.
If you play in a merged division 1 and get #9 you don't get to play playoffs.
And every game you play is pointless since you know there is nothing for you in the end.
Read, think, read again, think, read a couple more times, then post.
Cause you're the one being retarded atm, not the idea =)

#38, then introduce a gold playoff and a silver playoff and just put top8 in gold playoff, bottom 8 in silver playoff, everyone gets a playoff chance...

yea it's basically the same except no team can try to lose games on purpose to get into the silver playoff instead with my idea.

Sounds like a better team with lesser activity can be beat by a worse one with more activity (respawning 40 minutes for one point) and not getting to playoffs...interesting idea, not sure if it is going to make the team with less activity begin to idle more or not. Some people are on tight schedule these days.

Seeing as you would in your mind lose all games 2-0 against div1 teams the games should go faster.
Not to mention that div2 less than a day ago was 16 teams, I guess that's why so many teams posted here saying that there's no chance they have the time to play 15 games? oh wait.. noone complained about it.
So it has nothing to do with activity, just you not wanting to play a div1 team, ever.

#16 miku - 2011-09-20 14:40 (92.249.213.XXX)
Why dont you div1 guys do some coaching? Hlt, ihminen, and other well experienced div1 players could train some div2 materials into div1.

I have done this with Zoo, FT and now FU.
With Zoo we actually got some nice games vs top div1 clans... but damn it took a lot of time and tactical conversations... Also right players with good attitude.

"Sounds like a better team with lesser activity can be beat by a worse one with more activity"
This is true in any division, anytime, always.
If you don't play your games a team that plays all their games can get more points than you even if they are worse than you.
If you never want to play div1 teams just say so instead, don't make up false arguments that don't hold up at all.

Since there is radicalism in the air...

Convert frags to points. It would bring some meaning to the uneven matches. You could actually benefit from trying hard and not just waste 40 minutes.

#42 Oh yeah? http://eql.quakeworld.nu/eql12/matches/97#Played

Like I stated before, my idea only serves a purpose if _IF_ you actually want div1 and div2 teams to play eachother.
And if you do then my idea is simply a suggestion of a better way to do things then how they did it in eql12.

I think there are alot of teams/players both from div1 and from div2 that don't want to play eachother.
We all know that div1 teams want more teams and more competition in their division, but I think alot of them also don't want just a bunch of div2 teams to play that add no competition for anyone.

Personally I would prefer to stay in the current div2, I don't really care about div1 and I certainly don't want to play in or against div1 teams.
Again, it's just _IF_ div1 and div2 teams have to face eachother, atleast put some thought in how to make it somewhat more satisfactory for both sides.

I like rkds idea :E

Incredibly sporty of you, BLT. Even if you end up last in div1, that would still be a better achievement than first in div2.

Hats off for you!

This is me not posting as an admin:

Another team that should fit into div1 is obviously SD2 judging by their best lineup. But i guess they just dont wanna.